the_abecedarian

What, no formalwear option?

Looks like they’re making their own happiness!

The sport does the bonding, which provides these shitheads with an in for their ideologies.

Yes, it can become part of one’s culture to appreciate another’s culture

It’s possible, sure, but you’d have to do a study. As I mentioned, there are plenty of ways to interpret it.

I thought by adding “or whatever it’s called” would make it clear that I’m aware that the theory is a racist and antijewish lie, but I guess that was not enough. How should I have worded that differently?

Ah, OK! I think “if white people were defensive of their culture” is what threw me.

What would it mean to take the time and effort to learn to play the Erhu, understand its history and context, but somehow not show real respect for it?

To begin with, there can always be some jerk out there who gives you a hard time no matter what, or who has had so many bad experiences with ppl thoughtlessly appropriating culture that their mind is just closed and they react badly. You’d just have to defend it and let reasonable ppl see that that person is wrong to call you out. That aside, I think showing respect means that if an instrument is sacred for some reason (I have no idea if the Erhu is), you don’t play it in a profane or silly way. Outside of that, using an instrument as like a way to make fun of the culture would be bad (e.g. playing it whenever a stereotyped character appears on screen). Just my two cents.

If you see a number of people from Asian cultures playing classical music originating from Europe, does that mean it has become part of their culture? What if they are appreciating music from another culture? What if their families originate somewhere in Asia but they feel no connection to that place? Or what if there are more extracurricular opportunities for European-style orchestras than for other kinds of musical ensembles from other cultures?

The Great Replacement Theory is a racist and antijewish lie.

Edit: a white person who put in time and effort learning to play the Erhu, understood a reasonable amount of its history and context, and showed real respect for it would be fine.

Basically, your instincts are right and the question in the last line of your post is a good one. Here’s why:

“Whiteness” doesn’t come from biology or culture. It’s really just a way of describing a hierarchy that was set up by European empires and early corporations at the dawn of capitalism to justify the enslavement of people around the world, the colonization of their lands, and the exploitation of their natural resources for profit.

This hierarchy is used to steamroll over the huge number of ethnic and cultural backgrounds people have, in order to label some “white”, others “black”, others “asian”, and so on. There can be no “white” culture (even within one country), because the boundaries of who is accepted as “white” have shifted more than once in the past few hundred years and could easily shift again. For example, look up when and why Irish people and Italian people were accepted as fully white and look up the “contingent” whiteness that Jewish people have had in the US. See How the Irish Became White, for example.

Another reason there is no white culture is because, even for people accepted as white, whiteness has erased the cultures they brought to America when they immigrated by forcing them to conform to its rules. Think about how badly even light-skinned immigrants were treated by others whose families had been in America for generations. The immense pressure to look, sound, and act “American” and “white” to avoid being bullied at school, to be able to get good jobs, and to be seen as “respectable” in the neighborhood, meant for many people that they had to give up large parts of their culture to be accepted. This compounds over the generations, until we end up with people asking questions like the post you’ve made right here.

Racists proudly defend white (or “western” if they’re cowards) culture. They’re completely unable to see how whiteness has stolen big pieces of the cultures of everyone it touches. It has bleached them into a blander, more sterile version of what they once were.

I can see we’re not going to reach an agreement on how to look at this particular instance. Still, I wish you well and I hope people like you and me can find a way to effectively fight fascism going forward.

It’s also the publics job to be informed.

We’d get an informed public if people had enough time, material security, and agency to get involved in politics.

Even if it was identical under harris. It was still better under biden. He wasn’t actively cheering the genocide on etc. And at least gave some appearance of trying to support relief and peace.

This is infuriating. The appearance of trying to support relief and peace? These people’s families are dying. The US is the number one funder and arms dealer to Israel. The few, milquetoast statements Biden/Harris made were only political cover to the overwhelming support for the genocide that the US provided. Look, you don’t have to personally care about this issue beyond appearances if you want, but it is a central issue to voters in a particularly politically-important location.

That you feel no responsibility or remorse. For helping to Usher fascism in. [etc]

Don’t make assumptions: I was not an activist in Michigan. I didn’t tell anyone not to vote for Biden/Harris. I voted for them, even in a place where it doesn’t matter. I’m just a stranger on the internet who is tired of Democrats paying more attention to the right than to, well, even the center, let alone the left. They know that there is no alternative vote for us, so they keep tacking right to try and pick off a few so-called “swing” voters. But, doing that demobilizes their base! You need to get people excited to vote, volunteer, donate, and campaign. It’s basic electoral strategy. They refuse to learn that lesson and so they lose to someone who has a smaller, but rabid base.

Also, why are we focusing on only the Palestinian voters in Michigan as the ones who lost the election when plenty of other voters there and other swing districts also didn’t vote Biden/Harris? Because they’re “supposed to” vote dem? Assumptions like that are part of why the democratic party loses elections to Trump. They made a decision to cater more to pro-Israel voters than voters who wanted to at least halt the genocide, it was an important strategic misstep. Zooming out, why aren’t dems able to contest more districts? There’s plenty of blame to go around.

Finally, if you think this one thing is what ushered fascism in, you haven’t been paying attention to the last 30 years of politics. Trump’s election is not an aberration, it’s an expression of a large and growing right-wing and fascist movement in the US.

Tolerating them is a form of support. They make spaces unsafe for others.

She was his VP!

First, it is the job of the political party to convince the voters to vote for them. But even then, we don’t actually know if the outcome for Gaza would be any different under Harris (I’m only referring to the two campaign ads shown, ignore the commentary after). Maybe the Democrats, with an eye toward the next election, could have said “hey we’re gonna lose Michigan unless you take a tougher line with Netanyahu”.

I don’t think it took much of a “masterful play” or much influence at all for the Palestinian and middle eastern origin populations in Michigan to demobilize or protest vote. They had been watching intense and horrific destruction of their families and place of origin for more than a year at that point and they watched Biden, with Harris as VP, transfer weapons and funding to Israel while reiterating their support for Israel and weakly “warning” them about going too far.

It’s a bit infantilizing to say that the Palestinian-Americans “got played”, as if they couldn’t see what was happening in one of the central issues of their lives and make a choice.

“Had been campaigning on” is a joke after Biden spent his term bending over backwards to get weapons and funding to Israel, veto UN resolutions in opposition, and avoid pressuring Netanyahu

The article itself, several paragraphs down, admits you can’t attribute trump’s win to Palestine activists:

"It’s hard to determine just how much of an impact efforts like Uncommitted or Abandon Harris had in the election results. After all, exit polls showed that voters were motivated more by the economy than by foreign policy. But in battleground states with large Arab-American populations, like Michigan, data suggests that the Israel-Hamas conflict turned people away from Harris. In Dearborn, the country’s largest Arab-majority city, election data showed that Trump won 42 percent of the vote while Harris received 36 percent—significantly less than the 69 percent that Biden earned in 2020.

But the activists note that it wasn’t just Dearborn and other Muslim-American enclaves that moved toward Republicans in 2024—nearly every district in the country moved to the right as well."

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