Does this mean Americans are going to revolt and build themselves a new government with new leaders who are not corrupt?
Ah yes, the solution to bad people in power is to not even bother trying to vote for change, doing nothing will totally solve this problem.
It certainly solved it when they did exactly that the last elections. I mean, israhell is not genociding gaza anymore, and prices are down… right?
Calling it israhell does make you sound like Trump. Why do people do this?
Israhell, USrael, Isreal… I don’t have the slightest bit of respect for that shithole of a nazi country so I’ll call it as I see fit, anything but its real name.
Sleepy Joe Biden, Demonrats etc. Its not edgy, just childish. But do as you please.
I’m getting the impression that you think I care about how others see me when I insult the modern nazis and… You’re wrong. I don’t. I enjoy calling them names of any kind. I don’t think they are more than an evil and dumb caricature of a human being so I’m treating them like such.
You don’t insult the " Nazis", you just insult yourself in a very childish way. And all the Hate that spills out of your Keyboard isn’t get less, while you just trying to find another creative way to make funny names. Try to be mature.
Try to be mature.
" I don’t think they are more than an evil and dumb caricature of a human being so I’m treating them like such."
This, by the way is original Nazi- Sprech! Nazi - Talk for non Germans.
Are you upset because I don’t think nazis deserve human treatment? Because that’s what it looks like. And just in case it wasn’t obvious, yes, I do think that nazis (like those zionists from USrael) crossed the line that separates them from human beings a while ago. If that bothers you, I strongly recommend you to block me, because I strongly believe that the only good nazi is a dead nazi.
“We”? Who’s we? Nintendo Wii? Or are you speaking French right now?
Most progressives did vote for Kamala, you clown. Criticizing and objecting and calling out a candidate’s bad policies does not mean they won’t vote for them if it comes down to it. You liberals are the most fragile wallflowers in the planet, there’s a reason people call you blue MAGA. You can’t fathom someone criticizing a person and still voting for them. It doesn’t compute in your fucking brain, you see any criticism as a sin and a sign that person will not vote, vote third party, or vote for the republican.
Newsflash, the world doesn’t work like that, you giant toddler in the body of a 30+ year old.
Are you sure you’re replying to the right post? Are you ok?
Sorry, I can’t tell if you’re one of those smarmy liberals or something else.
Well, for starters, don’t go calling “clown” someone you don’t even know based on a single sentence (let alone any of the other names you called me, but I digress…). The people I was referring to were not those who voted for Kamala and criticize what she does. But those who didn’t vote for her (roughly a 30% of the voting population) because “both sides”.
You call me “liberal” when you don’t even know if I’m from your continent (spoilers: I’m not) and don’t know what do I vote in my continent and my country (even more spoilers, I tend to vote the parties furthest in the left spectrum).
Then you call me “blue MAGA” (again, I’m not American, and I mean it as inhabitant of the whole continent) and a “fragile wallflower”? Mate, I’m autistic, if I were a “fragile wallflower” I would have already committed suicide for the amount of bullying I’ve suffered.
Not only I CAN fathom someone criticizing a person and still voting for them, I DO IT EVERY SINGLE TIME I FUCKING VOTE because I believe we should held politicians accountable.
The rest is not even worth of commenting because you just go saying senseless stuff.
Blue maga is Russian agitprop attempting to get progressives not to vote Dem. Don’t fall for it.
I mean, by absolute numbers, the genocide under Trump is actually less destructive than the genocide under Biden. Trump is more cruel and crass about it. But the cold hard inescapable truth is that far more Gazans died under Biden than will die under Trump. Trump has active malice about Palestinians, Biden simply didn’t even consider them human and worthy of any consideration whatsoever.
As far as prices, again, inflation is lower under Trump that it was under Biden.
I hate Trump’s guts, but you’re describing things that Biden objectively performed worse than Trump on. You’re falling for the assumption that Trump is automatically worse at Biden than everything.
Keep in mind, israel killed the journalists that were reporting the deaths early on, aka, during Biden’s term.
The most intensive bombing and fighting was during Biden’s term. That’s when most of the deaths happened. But, people will reflexively downvote the truth. All they know is that Trump=bad. Therefore, it’s impossible for any Democrat to ever be as bad or worse than him on anything. Blue MAGA at work.
Again, the death rate in Gaza has been like 65k since May of 2025. While I’ve heard from credible sources that deaths in Gaza alone are like 300k now. So you’re only basing your judgment on what was reported, while the journalist were doing it were still alive.
Blue maga isn’t a thing, that’s Russian agitprop and you’re mindlessly repeating it to get republicans elected in the midterms.
Why wouldn’t it be a thing? Do you think someone is magically immune to certain kinds of mental failings simply because of what color shirt they wear?
Stupid people are everywhere but you’re still repeating propaganda intended to benefit republicans. It also creates a false equivalency between republican and democratic platforms which is wildly disingenuous to anyone who isn’t stupid. It’s another attempt at both sides. Only stupid people fall for that shit.
true!
source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Gaza_war
Every single person you berate for “not voting for imperfect candidates” already fucking does it. You’re bashing people on your own team for the purpose of punching left. But every time we try to push on the fucking PRIMARY for a candidate that isn’t complete dogshit, you fucks sabotage them at every turn, and then act surprised when you lose because you forced the bad unimpressive corporate candidate forth due to “electability” and red scare bullshit.
Progressives as a collective are not marxist-leninists. Stop treating us like we are. MLs spend 16 hours a day being loud in the internet, most of us actual progressives have actual lives and organize IRL instead of wanking over Marx and telling Ukranian children they’re Nazis on social media.
No, they don’t already do that, because turnout is dogshit, if everyone did that we wouldn’t have that problem.
Please criticize the fuck out of the candidates and policies, they fucking suck and they need to know we want progressives not the crap they are parading around, but this meme isn’t doing that, it’s just sending the message that it’s pointless to try, it feels like right wing created content to keep people from bothering to vote at all, and when you look at the numbers, that’s exactly what’s happening.
As a criticism of the DNC, the meme’s pretty close to the truth, even if it does inspire apathy – like Lucy yanking the football away every time, it’s the DNC who sabotage nominees who intend to implement effective change of the system.
But since there’s no other viable ball to kick, the electorate need to kick anyway – and spend the rest of the time organizing on a national level and engaging politically on a local level to shitcan Lucy. (This metaphor isn’t especially extensible!)
As a criticism of the DNC, the meme’s pretty close to the truth, even if it does inspire apathy
The meme doesn’t inspire apathy. The party’s behavior does.
Please criticize the fuck out of the candidates and policies,
All criticism is welcome except any particular criticism.
but this meme isn’t doing that, it’s just sending the message that it’s pointless to try
No, the party sends that message. The meme just details the mechanism by which they send it.
American reading comprehension being under a 6th grade level doing the heavy lifting here, huh? The context of the original comic is Lucy yanking the ball away before Charlie has the chance to kick it. The lesson is that Charlie shouldn’t stop trying to kick the ball, it’s that Lucy should stop being an asshole by taking it. This is not trying to lower turnout for the DNC, this is trying to sarcastically say this manipulative shit doesn’t work and doesn’t increase turnout. It’s doing the fucking opposite of what you’re saying.
Plenty of candidates have won despite a multitude of criticism towards them. If your candidate can’t beat anyone because of those criticisms, then they were a weak candidate anyways.
Also it’s important to realize that Charlie Brown is a good-natured sucker being taken advantage of by a manipulative person.
Eventually even the most gullible suckers give up.
You’re spot on and these downvotes are EXACTLY why things are the way they are.
No, they don’t already do that, because turnout is dogshit, if everyone did that we wouldn’t have that problem.
This is a comforting lie educated liberals tell themselves. The truth is that today, the Democratic party represents voters who vote more reliably, while the Republicans represent more disengaged infrequent voters. This changed over the last decade or so, but people haven’t gotten the memo. It used to be that Republicans did better in low-turnout elections. But now the opposite is true. Republicans now thrive on low-information, low-engagement voters - the exact type of voters that would vote more in your scenario of everyone turning out. If everyone had voted in 2024, Trump would have won by an even larger margin.
This makes sense if you think about it. Today, Democrats’ real only message is, “vote strategically, we aren’t Republicans.” They offer very little of actual substance beyond not being Trump. Low-engagement voters aren’t going to care about your message of not being Trump. They don’t have the same loyalties regular voters do. And they’re not going to educate themselves on things like Project 2025.
Trump won low-engagement voters because he had simple direct messages that could reach them. Trump was going to put money in your pocket and clamp down on crime. That was his message. That was what he offered. Harris offered “I’m not Trump.” To a well-educated liberal, not being Trump is enough, as you pay attention to politics and know exactly what kind of evil shit Trump has gotten up to. But “I’m not Trump” doesn’t work for the low-engagement voters vital to win an election.
If you vote for Democrats in general elections, they’re not talking about you. There are a lot of dumbasses on the left who don’t vote, or throw their votes away on hopeless third parties.
If ya’ll run Gavin Newsom, I’m out.
No joke, Newsom is a BAD candidate, he’s not even pretending to be progressive, he’s your typical neo-liberal corporatist.
What, why, do you hate sick memes!? /s
If you vote for Democrats in general elections, they’re not talking about you.
Tell me you’ve never criticized the centrist wing of the party without saying you’ve never criticized the centrist wing of the party.
You need to consciously work on eliminating these Reddit speech patterns from your vocabulary. It’s like nails on a chalkboard.
Tone policing is certainly one way to indicate that you cannot address what I said. Concession accepted. You’ve never criticized the genocide wing, so you’ve never encountered the behavior of the genocide wing toward its critics.
The genocide wing blames everyone to the left of netanyahu for his pet’s loss, regardless of how they voted.
Except when we criticize the shit the DNC pulls you all show up and say, “oh, you just don’t want people to vote?!?!”
In this post, one of you replied to me:
I don’t vote. Good people don’t vote.
So the concern isn’t unfounded.
One of me? I’m pretty sure I’m the only one of me. And in response to your comment that I replied to you, you specifically said this wasn’t about those of us who do vote, so that comment has nothing to do with me at all.
Try again, maybe put on your thinking cap.
Did I lump you in with a group to which you do not belong? Heaven forfend!
Who is the “we” you are referring to here?
Except when we criticize the shit the DNC pulls you all show up and say, “oh, you just don’t want people to vote?!?!”
And who are the “you all”? iM pReTTy ShUr Im ThE OnLy OnE of MEEE!
So again, you said “if you vote, I’m not taking about you.” I said, “except when we criticize democrats you tell us we don’t want people to vote.” Then you lumped me in with people who don’t vote.
Is thinking really this hard for you? The “we” I’m referring to are the ones of us who vote and also are fed up with the way the DNC runs the party. This is just…not confusing. How are you this perplexed? Do you need a nap? You seem to be getting really emotional.
Those people are not numerous enough to matter. They’re mostly internet MLs who spend 16 hours a day yapping on social media so they look like the common consensus.
2016 Election: Stein Votes vs. Trump Margin
- Michigan: Trump won by 10,704 votes. Stein received 51,463 votes.
- Wisconsin: Trump won by 22,748 votes. Stein received 31,006 votes.
- Pennsylvania: Trump won by 46,765 votes. Stein received 49,678 votes.
Ahh yes blame the people who believe in democracy enough to vote their conscience, the smallest percentage of people. And not the cheaters.
Definitely not the bomb threats, the thrown out voter rolls, the mail-in ballots in ditches, the constant redistricting. It’s the tiniest percentage of people who have all the power.
Nevermind the Michigan Data, or the Pennsylvania Data. Or the 30%-40% that sit the fuck out every national election. No it’s that tiny percent.
For the record I voted Harris because I do believe in harm reduction over absolutism, but it’s fucking stupid to blame the third party voters that happen to actually believe in democracy and that you should vote for who you want, not who can win.
Frankly if we as a nation would had voted for a third party or independent candidate sooner, it’s quite possible the either Major Party would have died like the Whigs when the Republican Party came onto the scene.
Just think about it critically instead of continuing that stupid ass dogma that got us here in the first place.
Stein was a spoiler and a Russian asset, if voting your conscious meant voting for her your conscious is fuckin stupid.
You can see how refusing to distance herself from genocide left an opening that spoiler candidates could exploit, can’t you?
And since you and a bunch of other dopey centrists are gonna imagine that this is somehow an admission of a vote for stein if I don’t say this: I voted for harris.
I don’t disagree which is why I’ve never voted Stein. The Green Party has never been a serious third party to me, but seems to get brought up as a strawman at every turn when a blueberry wants to avoid their cognitive dissonance.
National elections are so close these days, any of these things could be the but-for difference maker in any given election. Certainly the large number of non-voters you mention (I’m note sure if any of those election fraud claims are consequential).
But, in this thread, we are responding to one particular group that consistently helps Republicans win, because they’re the ones who posted it, and they’re here in the comments to be argued with!
Except it’s never been their fault. Even in the “best” years third party voters make up less than 5% of the electorate. It’s a lie of statistics to not mention the non-voters. You’re telling me that the third party voters are more at fault than politician whose job is to get elected being unable to steal that percentage from the non voters?
No what does happen instead? What did The Democratic Party do not long before the election? Did they appeal to the Non-Voters? Or did they appeal to “moderate” Republicans? Did they go for the larger percentage, or one that was no doubt slim and taken for?
Like doesn’t it seem silly to blame 5 when 30 is such a larger number? Isn’t it dumb to blame people treating democracy like democracy instead of the politicians that won’t meet the electorate where it matters?
National elections are so close these days, any of these things could be the but-for difference maker in any given election.
The party should start behaving accordingly, then. Instead they alienate their base by sprinting to the right in an idiotic attempt to get republican votes. Republicans hate you. They are not going to vote for you.
You’re assuming all of those people are progressives. Quite the opposite, actually.
They don’t all have to be. Look closely again at the numbers and you’ll notice some are larger than others. Think of the implications of that.
Now do Claudia De La Cruz.
You do it, lazy.
I’ve made my point about you people supposedly not being numerous enough to matter. A few hundred thousand votes is easily enough to matter if the election is close enough. And you never know how close an election will be before it happens.
I’ve made my point about you people supposedly not being numerous enough to matter. A few hundred thousand votes is easily enough to matter if the election is close enough. And you never know how close an election will be before it happens.
So maybe the party should start treating us as though we’re people with agency whose votes they need.
Yes, my 12 made me very lazy.
Did you see this post? Its not about voting in primaries. It’s about not participating because the ball is going to be pulled out in front of you. Yes, vote in primaries. Also, vote in the general for the best candidate.
You say everyone already votes in the general, but that’s blatantly not true. There’s an especially rampant trolling effort to get people not to vote who would vote against Republicans. It’s strategic apathy. It happened last time, and it’s happening now. If you don’t see this, you’re blind.
The Democratic party’s support for genocide makes it really hard to tell where the legitimate criticism ends and the trolling begins.
And that’s nobody’s fault but theirs.
Really showing off that American education, “instead of voting for the less genocidal platform I’ll enable the much more genocidal platform because I don’t understand civics or harm reduction!”
Just saying, when you support genocide, some people will take a stand, and you won’t always like how they do it.
. . . not to mention lying about it, calling opponents of genocide antisemites . . .
I’m sorry if you still can’t see how some people would look at all of that and realize that both sides want them dead.
And a grade school understanding of civics should inform you that not voting is a vote for republicans, so you still made a choice and that choice was directly for everything that’s currently happening. Principles aren’t really relevant when the results are obvious.
Republicans weren’t committing genocide in 2024 -Democrats were.
Bullshit. Absolute drivel. More voting is what solves this not less
More voting is what solves this not less
Betrayal discourages voting, but the party keeps doing it anyway.
the party
I thought the only party that Ensign_Crab cared about was the United Russia party
I don’t trust them to run honest primaries either.
Yeah they’re exactly the same. That must be why you spend all your time shitting on the parties trying to stop the fascist but rarely say anything against the farther right parties. Makes sense
That must be why you spend all your time shitting on the parties trying to stop the fascist
Democrats try to appease fascists. They try to stop progressives. Haven’t you noticed?
but rarely say anything against the farther right parties.
I don’t have much occasion to reply to pushback from the farther right parties on lemmy. I’m ok with that. Please don’t invite them.
If progressives voted in the primaries in numbers then we’d have progressive candidates, but the average progressive seems to believe that the Dems are just as bad as the republicans because Americans are unfathomably stupid.
Ah yes, the solution to bad people in power is to not even bother trying to vote for change
Bad people in power make sure change isn’t on the ballot.
What about this comic makes you think the point is “Charlie should stop trying to kick the ball” and not “Lucy should stop pulling this shit”?
The Lucy pulling the football thing has always been about the fact that Lucy is an asshole that Charlie Brown should not trust, and that Charlie Brown should stop trying to kick the football.
Charlie Brown is right to be upset at Lucy’s behavior.
Try the completely empty slogan “vote for change you can believe in”, worked for the drone king
Shh! You’re challenging their “moral superiority”.
Chuck schumer has joined the chat from Israel
Didn’t vote for genocide? Smugly wow look at your “moral superiority”.
Not doing nothing! Rising up and overthrowing capitalism. How, you ask? You know, rising up! What practical plan is there for afterwards? Plenty of time to figure that out later!
This isn’t a gotcha. Most ideological demographics are tiny minorities too small to succeed alone, but 3% of the vote could be the difference between a narrow win and a narrow loss for the DNC.
If you need their votes, start acting like it.
Enjoying the Trump years, “anti”-fascist?
Progressives are not the ones who put you in this position. You did by consistently voting for weak, ineffective leaders. Low information, low engagement voters are what caused Trump to win. You can’t win those people with a “We’re not Trump” message, because for them that message is meaningless, they don’t have any party loyalties or even research who they vote for. They vote based on the message, and you’ve failed to deliver a good message for the past 10 years.
Also, learn the context of the original comic before embarrassing yourself in the replies.
If progressives voted in the primaries we’d have policy representation in the party. But we mostly don’t because of takes like yours.
Or because the corporate wing of the DNC sabotages them at every turn.
Except for when they get elected, which is pretty often.
If progressives voted in the primaries
We were denied that opportunity in 2024.
Were you? I voted in my primaries. Everyone I know did too.
I voted in the primaries I had available to me. You got the genocidal shit you wanted without a primary.
“Everyone but me wants genocide”
Put the insane club away and stop harassing people with unintelligible BS. You heard something and you are throwing it at everyone, even if its irrelevant.
Yes people want primaries. Duh. Not having one last time was an epic fuck-up. Bernie being screwed over also fucked us all. Or does he love genocide because you dislike him too?
Of COURSE everyone you disagree with loves genocide, dont you???
Which comic do you think I’ve misinterpreted, cranky progressive?
The one that this meme format used, dipshit. Have you bothered to learn what happens on it and why it’s being used here?
Well, there’s a comic in the post, and a comic in the comment thread we’re replying under, so I just wanted to clarify which one you were referring to. The “Lucy and the Football” trope is commonly used as an analogy for a sucker who keeps falling for the same trick. In this case, it’s calling progressives who vote for Democrats suckers, implying progressives should not vote for Democrats. This helps Republicans win. Dipshit.
No, it’s not that. The lesson of the comic is that Lucy should stop fucking yoinking the ball every time he tries to kick it. LUCY is the one being an asshole. AKA, the DNC begs for votes from progressives, promising things to them, and then they proceed to not only NOT do what they promised, but also refuse to do their fucking job. Which is the bare fucking minimum people should ask of politicians, but according to people like YOU that’s too much to ask and will result in them fucking losing as if criticism is going to derail their chances. If criticism derailed politicians into losing, TRUMP WOULD NOT BE IN THE WHITE HOUSE.
You’re part of the “54% of Americans read and interpret text at a level below 6th grade” statistic.
Your bespoke interpretation of the Lucy comic is self-serving and almost certainly wrong. Charles Schulz is long dead, so we can’t know for sure, but I’d bet if we could ask him what the point of the strip was, it would be something along the lines of “It’s funny that Charlie keeps falling for the same trick” and not “The reader is supposed to tsk tsk and say ‘Lucy really should cut that out!’”
It’s called slapstick. Believe it or not, it’s supposed to be funny.
deleted by creator
You’re very confident in your prediction that accelerationism will work out in the end.
Did you vote for Trump? Because that would have been the rational decision based on your worldview.
I don’t vote.
Good people don’t vote.
I may not be a good person but I try my best.
And at least I can claim the dignity of refusing to participate in the Epstein class’s quadrennial popularity contest.
Good people don’t vote.
Who told you that?
Good people don’t vote.
you allowed the epstein president another term. stop lying to yourself.
I’m sorry, what presidential candidate in the last five generations wasn’t part of the Epstein class?
Even Bill Clinton, a poor boy from rural Arkansas, got to be an honorary member of the Epstein class. And my God did he enjoy the privileges of that class.
you live in an entirely delusional world kiddo.
Obama is part of the epstein class huh?
anything to drag them down to the GOP side’s behavior, even if you have to make it up. You’re just a giant sad fucking example of people who can’t tell the difference between “not my pick” and “fascist fucks”
you didn’t get your way, you cried, and everyone else has to suffer your stupidity, you dolt
So you did vote for Trump.
Because nothing the United States is doing under Trump is different than what it was doing under Biden, and under Trump I, and under Obama, and under Bush, and under Clinton.
Fucking nothing.
bull fucking shit.
look, hate harris all you want, but iran? venezuela? cuba? migrants in cages?
fuck off with that bullshit, it’s not the same, you simply cannot fathom the concept of harm reduction and will happily burn all your allies because you didn’t get your way.
POLITICS IS NOT MARRIAGE, YOU DON’T GET TO PICK YOUR IDEAL PARTNER.
you fucking children damned us to all this bullshit. great fucking work.
look, hate harris all you want, but iran? venezuela? cuba? migrants in cages?
Remember Afghanistan? Iraq? Syria, Libya, Yemen, Ukraine? And also Iran, Venezuela, Cuba, and a dozen others? And all the proxy wars and “interventions” I’m forgetting about or that never made the news?
Pre-Trump America was less blatant in its warmongering. It made the effort to build “international consensus” before bombing the fuck out of poor brown people. And it preferred to made economic warfare, through sanctions, which don’t make headlines when they kill poor brown people.
Harris would have killed Iranians with sanctions rather than bombs. And perhaps you think that makes a difference. But whether a little girl dies of starvation from American sanctions, or is blown up by American bombs, she’s still fucking dead.
Fuck, Trump’s “random bombing go” strategy let Iran close the Strait and made America take the blame for it - and if that lets Iran negotiate with the world and end Western sanctions using the Strait as leverage, Trump’s war might end up saving more lives than it kills.
As for migrants in cages: Trump made no new laws. Trump made no new policies, even. Trump enforced existing laws more harshly and blatantly and publicly than America previously had. And Harris promised to do the same fucking thing in her campaign.
What’s happening to migrants today is what the American people wanted. The killings, the beatings, the disappearances, the private prisons and forced labor and inhumane conditions, all of it.
Only we saw it happen openly, on the streets in Minneapolis, in front of a million cell phones and cameras, instead of out in the Texas desert where the only cameras belong to the Border Patrol. And seeing the Border Patrol treat middle class white protesters like immigrants was too much for some people.
Putting migrants in cages is what America wants. America just doesn’t want to see the cages. It hurts their feelings.
bull fucking shit.
get fucked.
people like you will do anything to drag down the left so it seems as bad as the pedos and war criminals. get fucked with a red hot jackhammer you equivocating dirtbag
Crying because your shithole of a country was finally exposed for what they are?
No tears here baby, at least I can see the difference between trying on the left and fascism on the right. You keep voting for trump, get the life you deserve.
POLITICS IS NOT MARRIAGE, YOU DON’T GET TO PICK YOUR IDEAL PARTNER.
You got your ideal partner. You got genocide and don’t care who provides it.
What a fucking clown response.
Everyone they disagree with loves genocide, Crab whatever is a dumbass.
Centrists were fine with losing as long as they didn’t have to say no to netanyahu.
a lot of people assuming that the implied message of the meme is “Charlie Brown should stop trying to kick the ball” instead of “Lucy should stop pulling the ball away”
Vote in the primaries.
I dunno…
Voting for “the lesser evil” does have a proven track record of overthrowing the two party system…
Marxism–Leninism holds that a two-stage communist revolution is needed to replace capitalism. A vanguard party, organized through democratic centralism, would seize power on behalf of the proletariat and establish a one-party communist state. The state would control the means of production, suppress opposition, counter-revolution, and the bourgeoisie, and promote Soviet collectivism, to pave the way for an eventual communist society that would be classless and stateless.[12]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marxism–Leninism
How many elections has Jill Stein ran in?
When’s the last time a third party candidate even came close?
Why keep trying that when it keeps failing?
I think the real stall, has been the people furthest left in both of the two parties have been convinced to leave.
“Moderate” Republicans became neoliberals, and when they chased off the commies to third parties, we were left with two right wing parties.
We need the commies to start voting like Stalin always wanted them to, but today’s commies only know propaganda, they don’t know any history.
Edit:
And obviously for the neoliberals to go back to the Republican party primaries to pull them back to the center
Nations are made of people, that make local gov, that make state govs. We need to change the smallest part that makes up the rest of the machine before you can “fix” the 2 party system.
Everyone keeps taking about the DNC like it is some colossus. We can either change it to our liking or make our own, but either way it starts by changing the smallest parts first.
Yep
The problem is for a lot of people, they’ve only known a corrupt DNC.
The only purpose of the DNC, is supposed to be to run an unbiased presidential primary every four years, that’s literally it. The Democratic party should be “bottom up” like you describe.
This one is staying out of other primaries, but endorsing everyone that makes it to the general. Which is fine, the party shouldn’t be picking sides in any primary
It has no ethical reason for billions of dollars, so it’s been pumping all of it back to state parties who desperately need it.
They’re not lock and step with billionaire owned media, because why the fuck should they be?
People look at the DNC right now and are mad “it’s not doing anything”.
While at the same time saying unprompted that the problem has been the DNC was doing too much.
The current DNC is refusing to release the 2024 autopsy because it doesn’t support the genocide wing’s narrative.
Regardless of your politics, you need to vote for the best result in the system we have.
In the “first past the post” single-ballot-plurality-wins contests that dominate in America, anything but a vote for the runner up is an endorsement of the eventual winner.
For most Americans, the only real choices in the general elections are “R”, “D”, and “either”.
This election losing approach to needs to become dead and buried.
It really sucks. Absent a revolution of some kind, until you are sure you have enough to WIN 270 electoral college votes, everyone needs to keep voting for the lesser of two bad choices.
For a real revolution we also need 218 house members and 67 senators (out of the current totals of 435 and 100).
Could possibly get by with 50 senators plus the VP if all could be counted on to pass the necessary court reform.
For a real revolution we also need 218 house members and 67 senators
And then the football will be yanked away again as we get just enough manchins voting against.
True, thank you.
Regardless of your politics, you need to vote for the best result in the system we have.
If you want to win, you need to get people to vote for you. Democrats prefer to lose.
A party failing at messaging does not absolve voters from making intelligent decisions.
Parties have entire histories proving where they stand. It is voter’s responsibility to be aware of those histories in order to be informed voters. You can’t rely on a party’s messaging to inform voters, just appeal to their emotions.
Parties have entire histories proving where they stand.
Right. Democrats have a long history of betraying the left and shifting right.
When’s the last time a third party candidate even came close?
Ross Perot got nearly 20% of the vote in 1992 but none of the electoral college votes because the system design naturally leads to a two party system.
Kamala never won a single primary, but ran as a general election Democrat for president. Stop trying to make sense.
When’s the last time a third party candidate even came close?
Ross Perot came very close in 1992. He would have won if he hadn’t paused his campaign midway through the election. It would be very possible for a third party candidate to win in 2028 under the right circumstances. Imagine the DNC forces Harris through again. And the Republicans run JD Vance. You would have two incredibly unpopular candidates, each planning on winning by blackmailing their base with the “lesser of two evils” strategy. Then a third party candidate comes in, someone who doesn’t cleanly map to the right or left side of the spectrum. And they clean the clocks of the two unpopular turds.
Again, this almost happened within living memory. Hell, it happened within the lifetimes of nearly every Millennial. 1992 was not that long ago. The idea that a third party candidate simply cannot win is just Dem/Rep cope.
“DNC forces Harris”
Absent any evidence. Kind of like how Bernie flat out DID. NOT. WIN. in 2020. No shenanigans- he couldn’t muster support.
God I’d love a progressive candidate but America seems not to and Im tired of people making excuses for it. Show up or stfu.
Not all directed at you- mainly the prevailing attitude among Lemmings who think America is oh so progressive but rarely ever attains office of any kind.
2020? In 2020, the DNC literally coordinated for all the centrist candidates except Biden to drop out right before a critical primary day. Warren stayed in the race to divide the progressive vote, but literally all the centrist candidates except Biden dropped out simultaneously. There was absolutely ratfucking in the 2020 primary.
And what evidence could you possibly want for the DNC forcing Harris? They were literally the only people involved in selecting her as the candidate. The voters did not get a say.
Yeah no shit. You can’t convince your own party to vote for you you don’t deserve it.
That’s politics for all you morons. Bernie could’ve collaborated with Warren for one of them to drop in exchange for a cabinet position, etc. but they didn’t.
There’s nothing insidious about that. Centrists grouped and voters rewarded them for that. Bernie didn’t. I voted for him in 2020.
Simply put, progressives are more upset that there aren’t more of them or that they don’t show up. Either way they LOST because the majority of Democratic voters don’t vote that way.
Maybe they should spend more time convincing everyone of their positions instead of bitching at bogus bogeymen for all their failures.
Absent any evidence.
That’s why it’s a hypothetical and was framed as such. If she decides to run again, the party’s likely gonna try, all the while saying that AOC can’t run because a woman of color can’t win.
the GOP are too dangerous right now
Right now? When are they NOT dangerous?
Americans need to organize themselves out of 2 party system. It’s the only way and funnily enough - it would be a much more of an american system because US is all about competition, right?
“the left should have a united front and stop dividing itself!”
So… Vote for the one viable opposition party?
“No not like that”
Yeah here we go. Six months before an election we crank up the sirens that another way not only exists (despite it not existing), but that it’s clearly folly to support the one progressive option that’s actually on the ballot.
Actually, you can just vote for a progressive in the primary instead of a corporate democrat who will do effectively nothing against the GOP and won’t prosecute anyone in the Trump administration and fail just like Reconstruction. Crazy, isn’t it?
Okay, vote for progressives all you can. Do anything you can to convince other people to get actual progressives in the running. Print flyers, organize events, go door to door if you have to. If that all still fails and we’re stuck with the choice to ratchet to the right or stay where we are, then goddamn make the vote to stay where we are and do everything you can to try to ratchet to the left again. Pretty fucking simple choices
You’re talking to the wrong person. Every single one of my progressive friends hates the DNC with a passion. They do all of that PLUS they voted for Kamala still.
Maybe don’t treat all of us like we’re marxist-leninists for a change?
I see your account is a few months old, but trust us - the marxist-leninists (and Other) are very much in all these threads. It’s not a reach to go from “DNC sux” to “refuse to vote! Seize the means of production! Death to the bourgeoise!” It happens. Kind of a lot.
Okay, but to be fair, we should probably Guillotine the Epstein Class, and create employee owned businesses. Would probably benefit a lot of people.
As for voting, we will always need to vote. All governments are a monopoly on violence, and voting is one of the ways to direct that violence. It’s mine, and no doubt many others, preferred way of directing that violence. In opposition to dictators, kings, and other unelected versions of governance directing said violence.
So I do view those refusing to vote as naive at best, and dumber than a stump at worst.
Ok but your two realistic options for achieving those goals is either to pick up a gun and go do it yourself by force or to participate in our admittedly shitty system and put Democrats and specifically progressive Democrats where possible in power. So which ya gonna do?
Well considering people are being locked up in concentration camps, shot in the street in broad daylight, and the feckless opposition party constantly rolls over. Probably the gun, since I’ve already organized with my neighbors in case ICE shows up.
Glad I could clear that up for you though.
Edit: Oh and that’s a false dilemma since voting is also backed by guns, they’re just used by a third party so we can abstract away the inherent violence that allows a government to be a government.
Actual leftists spend the day working or volunteering. Internet Marxist-Leninists spend 16 hours a day on social media. That’s why it looks like they’re so numerous.
Yes… where do you think you’re commenting right now?
Tap for spoiler
The Internet
What I meant by that is that most leftists don’t have time to show their messaging to others because they can’t spend too much time in the internet due to having lives. MLs in the internet are mostly unemployed dipshits who spend every hour of their day they’re not sleeping attacking people on social media or wanking themselves off to theory written 150 years ago - that’s why it looks like there’s a lot more of them when it’s the complete opposite. They’re a statistical anomaly.
It’s not a reach to go from “DNC sux” to “refuse to vote! Seize the means of production! Death to the bourgeoise!” It happens. Kind of a lot.
In the fanfic written by people who don’t want the party to ever move to the left.
Primaries and local elections matter a lot. I don’t think the system is fit to survive long-term, but an engaged electorate would keep things going quite a while longer.
That’s not the way it works.
We’ve seen exactly what happens to progressives in the primary.
The Democratic party is NOT democratic, see Sanders vs. Clinton.
Lots of progressives have won state congress/senate primaries so far. Those are what actually matter.
Actually, you can just vote for a progressive in the primary
And the party never pulls any shady shit in the primaries, when they aren’t denying us primaries entirely.
I mean, a lot of progressives have been winning congress/senate primaries so far…
The party’s ratfucking isn’t always successful. But any wins are despite the party’s opposition, not due to a lack of it.
Save it for the general election, not the primary where it isn’t applicable.
This argument would hold water if your wing of the party hadn’t tied the one guy to the tracks in the first place and didn’t have it in their power at the time to untie him. In any event, centrists blame anyone with even the slightest criticism of their beloved genocide regardless of how they actually voted.
Everyone I disagree with loves genocide.
The context here is genocide and centrists’ refusal to abandon it.
Which centrists? You direct that at everyone who is, and who you think is, a “centrist”, without defining a set of positions you believe they have. Why are they all a genocide supporting monolith? Or are you taking people and assuming many things about them like another group tends to towards specific races?
Define, dont attack. Debate over argument. Conversation over debate. No reason to wreck your position with exaggerated responses and statements. The world isnt a strawman, my dude.
The leadership of the centrist wing of the party supports genocide. The centrist wing of the party continues to follow them, knowing full well what they’re doing in broad daylight. Genocide isn’t a dealbreaker for them.
It’s like how all the awful fascist racist shit trump does isn’t a dealbreaker for republicans. It says what you need to know about them.
The trolley problem is used to pretend harm reduction works, but if you extend the image, you’ll find all the ones tied on the bottom rail will be moved to the top rail, just spaced out so that one side can pretend they’re slightly better, even though they’ll end up killing the same people anyway. If you think it’s acceptable to let “the good guys” carry out a genocide, then you’ll find anything acceptable. Keep sacrificing one group after the other as you justify your harm reduction scheme.
“First they came for[…]” I’ll let you figure out the rest.
“Stop whining about a literal genocide!!!”
Also, the people who didn’t vote were mostly liberals. Every progressive I know, including every member of large progressive organizations, voted Kamala.
But also, thanks for essentially saying that you’d gladly sacrifice hundreds of thousands of brown people overseas to not have to deal with fascism. This is why the world thinks Americans are scum.
Now were sacrificing millions of brown people to let the fascists win in 3 separate countries and the US is directly doing one of them.
We’re not going to failure gambit our way to victory by letting the fascists win and showing the world how bad fascism is and everyone banding together and stopping fascism ones and for all.
I’ve got news for you: if you support genocide then you’re already a fascist.
Yeah supporting genocide is fascistic. So is letting Trump anywhere near the levers of power to accelerate 1 genocide into 3 genocides.
Choosing the least bad option is not supporting genocide, it’s practicing harm reduction. This makes sense to anyone not stupid or an accelerationist.
The least bad option, if you assume we only have two options, also supports genocide. Maybe the stupid one is the one who plays along with this stupid game. You’re not going to break out of the game by playing within its rules, especially when the rules change any time a potential exploit is found. Slow torture with breaks is still torture.
if you assume we only have two options
There is no assumption, genius.
The most popular 3rd party candidate in 2024 got a whopping 0.5% of the total votes cast. During an election when many people were disenfranchised from both primary parties.
I’m going to bold this for you.
THERE IS NO VIABLE 3RD PARTY IN THE UNITED STATES AND WON’T BE FOR A LONG, LONG TIME UNDER THE BEST CIRCUMSTANCES.
Maybe the stupid one is the one who plays along with this stupid game.
It’s not a game, champ. It’s reality. And you don’t seem to have a firm grasp on it. In reality, where two (and only two) parties have the potential to win, someone making an effort to be an adult understands that it is far better to go with the least destructive option. And, from your simple perspective, it’s not like we were choosing between a genocide party and a non-genocide party. From your simple perspective, they’re both genocide parties. On one hand you had one that was expressing their disapproval of Israel’s actions and floating arms shipment cancellations and trying to help broker a peace deal. And on the other you had a felon rapist saying “full steam ahead, we’ll make a resort out of Palestine when you’re done”.
Doesn’t take a lot of brain cells to figure that one out.
You’re not going to break out of the game by playing within its rules
Lol. You must be young. Want a revolution? That’s what you’re implying. Do it, kiddo. Be the leader. Be the change. Otherwise sit down and help the adults vote in the better option so we have better odds to reform our current system.
And if you believe that the odds of reforming this system are the same under Democrats and Republicans, then you’re a lost cause and there’s not much else I can say to you.
I mean historically you’re absolutely wrong but go off, keep going with the even more genocide option, that’ll work out for you.
For the first time you lot have consequences for your imperialism, and yet you still refuse to learn a lesson from it. You get zero fucking sympathy from me. Ineffective, weak leaders is what leads to fascism. Those are the consequences of your actions. You can cry all you want, but all of those deaths are on YOU for consistently voting for leaders that haven’t changed their strategy since the 90’s and sabotage anyone trying to run on their party for positive change.
Also, you wanna learn something? Republicans now get significantly more votes from low attention, low engagement voters. Saying “We’re not Trump” doesn’t do anything for them. They don’t have loyalties. They don’t even bother researching. That’s why Trump was so popular with them, he had a direct message that reached them. Most Democrat voters are already highly engaged, and that isn’t enough to win elections anymore. As long as you refuse to court low engagement voters by actually delivering a message, you’ll keep failing.
Genocide. We get it. Keep saying it and maybe you’ll make it mean more. We all totally believe Biden/Harris/Dems like genocide cuz you keep saying it.
Now we have a president and party that give way less fucks about genocide. Yay?
Biden and Kamala are on record, multiple times, supporting Israel. The entire Dem corporate wing, instead of listening to all the people protesting, lambasted everyone as terrorist supporters and refused to stop sending weapon packages even with IDF soldiers literally posting their war crimes on Tiktok.
All America does is export death and destruction. This has been the rule for 80 years. No matter who’s in charge.
You deserve what you got. America was exposed for the merchant of death that they are, and you will never be trusted again. People will vote in progressives in the primaries, win, and YOU will be nothing but part of history.
There’s a reason everyone hates the US. There’s a reason everyone hates you. You’d rather have your option to go back to brunch and not think about all the brown people your party killed in collusion with the Republicans.
Do everyone a favor, and shove your politics up your ass.
What people think the person on the top rail is saying: oh please, kill me! I want nothing more than to die to save people in the country helping bomb my family!
I wish I could upvote this twice.
I wish even more that the people who think like this could look at this and understand it. Too much critical thinking required. That or they’re just garbage people who want it exactly their way and are willing to burn it all down if they don’t get it.
The thing that really frustrates me is the entitlement of people thinking that both sides are the same, blah blah blah while meanwhile immigrants, LGBTQ people, Iranians, etc. etc. suffer because perfect is the enemy of better in their minds. The comic is unrealistic because typically the person watches the carnage smugly, claiming that it would have been just as bad if the Democrats were in power, as if 2024 were just as bad as now.
No we’ve been saying this since kkkopmala got the nomination WITHOUT A PRIMARY.
Disclaimer: I am not from US
She was chosen because she was Vice President. Not that it matters much. People were furious that government lied about mental state of Biden that also was fucking obvious to everyone. They should’ve ran primaries but they claimed he’s fine and lost by putting the least voted candidate on previous primaries. Not even sure what they expected.
Doesn’t help that they also are constantly pushing back a legit good candidates.
You’d think people would vote for DNC to just not let Trump come back. And I can see why they would. But these constant lies, schemes and general situation in the country made many to not to go to the polls. Like if you know your team lies to you, but the other team also does and is fucking nuts, would you still give your vote for party that lied to you on many occasions? That didn’t listen to you to begin with?
After last elections if people see DNC as “the good guys”, that’s a Stockholm syndrome. It is time to change. And if DNC won’t listen to people, nothing will change.
Centrists sent the message to progressives that their votes were neither needed nor sought.
Until harris lost, then their perfect candidate was let down by the people who tried to kick the football and missed. After all, they pointed out how many times they tried to kick the football before and how many times it was yanked away. Which means they wanted trump to win.
Yup.
The most popular 3rd party candidate in 2024 got a whopping 0.5% of the total votes cast. During an election where people were disenfranchised with both primary parties.
Vote. Vote in local things. Spend a few minutes reading about encumbants or ballot measures. Don’t be spurred to inaction.
At some point, ‘next election’ can’t keep replacing real action people need right now.
As long as everyone collectively doesn’t decide to primary every incumbent corporate Democrat and put a progressive in their places, this will keep happening. So far a bunch of them have already won. We need more.
Anyways, the comic context is that Lucy is taking the ball away before Charlie can kick it. This isn’t about not doing anything. It’s about the DNC manipulating the voters into doing what they want and then yanking away their promise.
Uh Oh you dared to criticize the DNC and now you’ve angered the blue maga. Don’t you know that anyone who questions the neoliberal corporate talking points is the reason fascism is rising and nothing else at all?
Anyone have that ratcheting effect graphic lol?
